The amount of people simping for Russia in that other thread is insane. Apparently calling Ukraine a country of Nazis is fine, but saying Russia is a dictatorship is not lmao.
If you see a tankie or pro Russia comment, 99% of the time it’s a lemmy.ml poster
I guess, you got to check IP and see what country it belongs to, but if they use a VPS or VPN or both, you can’t really know where the person who manages the instance lives / operates.
Yea I figured it’s just a bunch of middle class kids who have the privilege of being online and complain. Also fuck Hexbear…all my homies hate Hexbear.
yep I got banned from there for simply stating that ukraine has a right to defend themselves after Modi called for “peace”. Apparently absolute pacifism is only required from one side.
Did you miss the fact that it’s not a blanket ban on Russians? If you work for a sanctioned company, then I’m sorry but you are out. Missed the chance to jump ship in the last twenty years of Putin turning Russia into a dictatorship? Well, I hope you like being sent to your death. Sad times, but let’s not pretend that this is discrimination.
From what I saw in the executive order it wasn’t limited to just sanctioned companies. Linus and other maintainers haven’t come out with which specific sanction they’re talking about so its just speculation
I heard Russia is full of Nazis, and if that level of hearsay is fine for staging a multi year invasion and destroying a thousand years of history it’s just FINE for segregating bad-actors and persona non grata.
Can’t deal with it? Move to a less shitty company not sanctioned by scumbags. Or even a less tribal country 🤷
I heard Russia is full of Nazis, and if that level of hearsay is fine for staging a multi year invasion and destroying a thousand years of history it’s just FINE for segregating bad-actors and persona non grata.
Yeah, when I created my Lemmy account I had to choose an instance before knowing anything about Lemmy yet. And .ml seemed like the default one to choose, given https://join-lemmy.org/ told me it is ran by the devs.
Doesn’t help if the admins think you’re not. Which is why I had to relocate a community because of admin content meddling and instance users shitstorming in a waterglass.
Yesterday I accidentally commented in .ml and mentioned that voting third party in our current voting system is playing with fire to get a worse candidate in office. I was told I must therefore start a grassroots movement for ranked choice voting, because apparently I can’t have an opinion without a movement.
Normally I let a few downvotes get under my skin more than I care to admit, but in this setting it was kind of a badge of honor. Honestly it was kind of “fun” to see what people were saying.
I would encourage that, but if your instance doesn’t defederate them you may have to go a bit farther since you’ll still get replies from lemmy.ml users, as users are not blocked as part of this functionality. And that is by design, it’s not meant to act as a replacement or alternative to defederation, it’s meant to act as an alternative to blocking all communities on an instance.
This is about open-source being open. I’m a very non-tankie, and I think this is bad- though a bit better if its only people working for sanctioned companies.
Go look at the principles of open-source or free software as defined either by the OSI and the FSF and then come back when you find the one that says that Linus needs to violate US sanctions to keep employees of Russian companies in trusted roles within his project.
Also, what does this have to do with being tankie or not? Modern Russia is very openly not communist.
.ml is full of tankies. Also, nothing in open-source principles say that to my knowledge. Am I not allowed to have beliefs not explicitly defined by the OSI?
The OSI’s definition of open-source software is the de facto definition used by most people, and for most of the remaining people that don’t, they (mistakenly, because they define “free” software, not “open-source”) defer to the FSF’s defintion of free software.
So yes, you should be explicitly noting that what you define as “open” has nothing at all to do with the far-and-away most widely used definition(s) of “open-source”.
Yes, and I said I want open-source to be open. As in not just open-source, but also open to all. That is my personal moral value, and I advocate for that. What the OSI supports has nothing to do with that.
I want a lot of things too, but what I want most of all is to live in a society governed by the rule of law. There are no absolute rights - limiting the freedoms of people who are complicit in crimes or enable them is how we protect the rights of everyone else. Simple as.
The limitations didn’t target a nationality, they targetted sanctioned entities. And you know this because it has been made clear throughout this thread, including in numerous replies to your own comments. So you are demonstrably and obviously disingenious, not engaging in good faith or have yourself been misled. This behavior logically leads people to the conclusion that you are either being deliberately manipulative or you are confused and have been deliberately manipulated. Sadly, the end result is the same in both cases and regardless of your intention.
I wish you the best. We should all be a lot more dedicated to intellectual honesty.
Please stip blocking people, please stip talking about blocking everyone
Yes, i gettit. Different opinions can be annoying but if we don’t all participate in. A similar environment.we all just disappear in our little echo chamber pillars, unable to hear or understand the others, which leads to more extremist opinions on all sides.
We NEED to hear others, if not just for the fact that others may NEED to hear our voices too.
I honestly this echo chamber crap is squarely caused by the Internet, the tool that promised to bring humanity together, and instead ended up dividing us more than ever because anyone hearing an opinion they don’t like immediately bans that voice. Can’t have anyone disagreeing now!
I get it, there are some stupid opinions out there, dangerous ones too, but the more we ban them, the more they will only be able to talk eachother into extremism and the WILL be back, with more people, and more extremist opinions.
FFS, we need to learn to start listening to each other again. An entire generation has grown up with “if you don’t like to hear that opinion, just have it banned”, and it’s not helpful.
Early Internet was a wild west crazy town for sure, loads of assholes lurking around, but it was better than what we have now, where EVERY space is curated and hawkishly guarded against those that might even look in the wrong direction.
I’ve spent quite some time on right wing subs back in the day in Reddit, discussing whatever topic with hard line conservative right wing types and when you do you find out they are human too, usually with a lot of fears, and you actually get to understand why they feel the way they feel, and you can get them to understand that yeah, maybe it’s not the best solution. You find common ground and got somebody a little closer to the light. Yes, I’m a big fan of that black guy (forgot his name) who goes out to talk to KKK members to convert them away from the KKK.
I know this isn’t for everyone, but a lot of us can and should step up and start talking, start listening. I’m not saying st all you should agree with a neo nazi, but you can listen to him or her, understand where they’re coming from, and have them do the same. Once you both see the humanity in each other you can actually make everyone be a little better.
It’s better than the alternative where the inevitable outcome is that we’ll start having civil wars everywhere and just kill those we oppose.
… but seriously, the Internet is so different from real life that no comparisons make sense. Opinions that would have been uttered by the craziest village idiots in a local gas station 30 years ago are now distributed and magnified by the social media machine. In the past, you could see with your eyes, hear with your ears and even smell with your nose which people you really really should not listen to, but in the internet, those people look exactly like you and me.
And it’s all sapping your energy and time, the most precious resources you have.
That’s why blocking is fine, even whole instances if they are shown to be crazy enough.
Also, I would like to point out that the creators of the clients for the first community platforms (usenet) recognized early on the importance of shutting people up (killfiles).
I understand what you mean but I’ll have to disagree. Letting people just do anything like that is like not charging criminals for the crimes they’ve commited. It could make people act similarly.
We NEED to hear others, if not just for the fact that others may NEED to hear our voices too.
We have tried engaging in good faith, but they don’t WANT to hear us. For example, the mods of [email protected] (specifically https://lemmy.ml/u/OurToothbrush) ban for people for simply disagreeing with them. Happened to me and I’ve seen multiple others.
I’m surprised to find somebody with some sense around here.
I have never used a block or mute feature on any site or any service in all my life. It is wild to me that people today actually use those features, let alone to constrict the ideas that they allow themselves to be exposed to.
I conducted a fun little experiment over at /c/[email protected] in which I posited the question: “If it were possible, how would you deprogram an extreme conservative?”. I then waited twenty hours before posting “If it were possible, how would you deprogram an extreme progressive?”. The difference in reception between the questions exposed the intense lib-left bias that is pervasive on Lemmy, a byproduct of people constantly walling themselves into self-made echochambers.
I hope people do not do that and take into account this campaign against lemmy.ml. I am aware of the accusations against the admins of this instance, but I practically never see here this kind of brigading, campaigning against whole instances like lemmy.world. Sure, I myself did make a bad comment or two about lemmy.world out of >800 comments, but that’s normal. I think the fair thing to do, is to respond in the same scale (i. e. blocking specific users) instead of going all ballistic with instance blocks.
I’d also like an option to just block/hide the instance part of user names. I don’t like what this bit of information is doing to discussions in Lemmy.
I know I can. Being blocked is something I do not have any issues with. My comment was merely my point of view. If someone is being actively bothered by the admins of the instance I’m in, it’s completely fair to block it. However, to block whole instances for ideological differences is kind of immature.
I don’t like what this bit of information is doing to discussions in Lemmy.
Cool. That’s fine that you don’t like it. However people have a right to not see what they don’t want to see. If they decide that means it’s lemmy.ml, then that’s their right.
Just like I have a right to not peer with lemmy.ml if I didn’t want to.
Hell I have a hard block on ALL Russian and Chinese IP addresses. Not because I have something against the people. But I just don’t want to deal with the headache of accepting traffic from those countries.
Just because some (or even a majority) of the people on lemmy.ml are fine to interact with doesn’t mean that there isn’t contention from other users and admins on that instance.
I think the fair thing to do, is to respond in the same scale (i. e. blocking specific users) instead of going all ballistic with instance blocks.
it’s not just random users, the mods of larger communities like [email protected] will delete your comments and ban you simply for disagreeing with them.
For this, some people proposed to move the community from one instance to another. Now, it seems to me like the incentive to comment on instances ideologically biased for people who cares about the voting system is basically to troll the opposing instance. Which leads to this petty battle that I will ignore from now on.
EDIT: It’s also interesting to note that lemmy.ml is not like any other instance. In fact, it would be beneficial to not have big communities here. My account is here because it’s an old account, but lemmy.ml should be more like a “testing” instance, and they probably shouldn’t be signing up more people. The admins and devs acknowledge this from time to time. So, I guess everyone wins with this.
Save your sanity and do Settings -> Blocks -> Block instance -> lemmy.ml
Also perhaps block me if you strongly disagree with the above.
That instance’s mods blocked me this morning lol.
The amount of people simping for Russia in that other thread is insane. Apparently calling Ukraine a country of Nazis is fine, but saying Russia is a dictatorship is not lmao.
If you see a tankie or pro Russia comment, 99% of the time it’s a lemmy.ml poster
Hexgears and of course lemmygrad.ml are of the same kind
😄exactly! Phu, the brain gymnastics that those people are capable of is mind bending 🤣
Yeah, but most instances already defederated from them.
Can we see where someone is hosting a Lemmy (domain, insnace, thing?)
I guess, you got to check IP and see what country it belongs to, but if they use a VPS or VPN or both, you can’t really know where the person who manages the instance lives / operates.
Sometimes it is posted on the instance front page or about page.
Well I doubt it’s Mali.
https://check-host.net/ip-info?host=lemmy.ml
France. Maybe. It’s mostly guesswork, but gives the same location for hexbear.net.
It’s mostly cosplay commies rather than actual Russians.
Yea I figured it’s just a bunch of middle class kids who have the privilege of being online and complain. Also fuck Hexbear…all my homies hate Hexbear.
yep I got banned from there for simply stating that ukraine has a right to defend themselves after Modi called for “peace”. Apparently absolute pacifism is only required from one side.
deleted by creator
This topic has nothing to do with being “pro-Russian” instead its being pro-individualist and pro-open source
I’m pro open source, which is why I don’t want the Russian government interfering with it for their own geopolitical bullshit.
I agree, but people aren’t their government. Discriminating based on nationality is xenophobia.
Did you miss the fact that it’s not a blanket ban on Russians? If you work for a sanctioned company, then I’m sorry but you are out. Missed the chance to jump ship in the last twenty years of Putin turning Russia into a dictatorship? Well, I hope you like being sent to your death. Sad times, but let’s not pretend that this is discrimination.
From what I saw in the executive order it wasn’t limited to just sanctioned companies. Linus and other maintainers haven’t come out with which specific sanction they’re talking about so its just speculation
Banning contributions from sanctioned russian companies is not xenophobia. Pipe down.
I heard Russia is full of Nazis, and if that level of hearsay is fine for staging a multi year invasion and destroying a thousand years of history it’s just FINE for segregating bad-actors and persona non grata.
Can’t deal with it? Move to a less shitty company not sanctioned by scumbags. Or even a less tribal country 🤷
Linux maintainers aren’t invading Ukraine
Can we really be sure?
I mean, I’d love to see if there’s any evidence to the contrary xd
deleted by creator
Some of us are actually normal
Yeah, when I created my Lemmy account I had to choose an instance before knowing anything about Lemmy yet. And .ml seemed like the default one to choose, given https://join-lemmy.org/ told me it is ran by the devs.
Oh well.
Similar story here tbh.
I see you, hang in there buddy!
Doesn’t help if the admins think you’re not. Which is why I had to relocate a community because of admin content meddling and instance users shitstorming in a waterglass.
I love it here as well 😁
Ee is cool, but your upload limits were crap.
Fair, but most of the time, photos that I post won’t get any better with more pixels anyway 😂
I throw a lot of low effort memes, so I need all the help I can get.
Seriously, the hexbears just moved one over to keep getting exposure.
Yesterday I accidentally commented in .ml and mentioned that voting third party in our current voting system is playing with fire to get a worse candidate in office. I was told I must therefore start a grassroots movement for ranked choice voting, because apparently I can’t have an opinion without a movement.
Normally I let a few downvotes get under my skin more than I care to admit, but in this setting it was kind of a badge of honor. Honestly it was kind of “fun” to see what people were saying.
I approve this comment.
improved my lemmy experience ten fold just blocking that instance.
I would encourage that, but if your instance doesn’t defederate them you may have to go a bit farther since you’ll still get replies from lemmy.ml users, as users are not blocked as part of this functionality. And that is by design, it’s not meant to act as a replacement or alternative to defederation, it’s meant to act as an alternative to blocking all communities on an instance.
This is about open-source being open. I’m a very non-tankie, and I think this is bad- though a bit better if its only people working for sanctioned companies.
Go look at the principles of open-source or free software as defined either by the OSI and the FSF and then come back when you find the one that says that Linus needs to violate US sanctions to keep employees of Russian companies in trusted roles within his project.
Also, what does this have to do with being tankie or not? Modern Russia is very openly not communist.
.ml is full of tankies. Also, nothing in open-source principles say that to my knowledge. Am I not allowed to have beliefs not explicitly defined by the OSI?
The OSI’s definition of open-source software is the de facto definition used by most people, and for most of the remaining people that don’t, they (mistakenly, because they define “free” software, not “open-source”) defer to the FSF’s defintion of free software.
So yes, you should be explicitly noting that what you define as “open” has nothing at all to do with the far-and-away most widely used definition(s) of “open-source”.
Yes, and I said I want open-source to be open. As in not just open-source, but also open to all. That is my personal moral value, and I advocate for that. What the OSI supports has nothing to do with that.
I want a lot of things too, but what I want most of all is to live in a society governed by the rule of law. There are no absolute rights - limiting the freedoms of people who are complicit in crimes or enable them is how we protect the rights of everyone else. Simple as.
Limiting the freedoms of innocent people who happen to live in a country doesn’t protect the rights of others.
The limitations didn’t target a nationality, they targetted sanctioned entities. And you know this because it has been made clear throughout this thread, including in numerous replies to your own comments. So you are demonstrably and obviously disingenious, not engaging in good faith or have yourself been misled. This behavior logically leads people to the conclusion that you are either being deliberately manipulative or you are confused and have been deliberately manipulated. Sadly, the end result is the same in both cases and regardless of your intention.
I wish you the best. We should all be a lot more dedicated to intellectual honesty.
tell that to the mods of [email protected] who ban you for disagreeing with them.
Please stip blocking people, please stip talking about blocking everyone
Yes, i gettit. Different opinions can be annoying but if we don’t all participate in. A similar environment.we all just disappear in our little echo chamber pillars, unable to hear or understand the others, which leads to more extremist opinions on all sides.
We NEED to hear others, if not just for the fact that others may NEED to hear our voices too.
I honestly this echo chamber crap is squarely caused by the Internet, the tool that promised to bring humanity together, and instead ended up dividing us more than ever because anyone hearing an opinion they don’t like immediately bans that voice. Can’t have anyone disagreeing now!
I get it, there are some stupid opinions out there, dangerous ones too, but the more we ban them, the more they will only be able to talk eachother into extremism and the WILL be back, with more people, and more extremist opinions.
FFS, we need to learn to start listening to each other again. An entire generation has grown up with “if you don’t like to hear that opinion, just have it banned”, and it’s not helpful.
Early Internet was a wild west crazy town for sure, loads of assholes lurking around, but it was better than what we have now, where EVERY space is curated and hawkishly guarded against those that might even look in the wrong direction.
I’ve spent quite some time on right wing subs back in the day in Reddit, discussing whatever topic with hard line conservative right wing types and when you do you find out they are human too, usually with a lot of fears, and you actually get to understand why they feel the way they feel, and you can get them to understand that yeah, maybe it’s not the best solution. You find common ground and got somebody a little closer to the light. Yes, I’m a big fan of that black guy (forgot his name) who goes out to talk to KKK members to convert them away from the KKK.
I know this isn’t for everyone, but a lot of us can and should step up and start talking, start listening. I’m not saying st all you should agree with a neo nazi, but you can listen to him or her, understand where they’re coming from, and have them do the same. Once you both see the humanity in each other you can actually make everyone be a little better.
It’s better than the alternative where the inevitable outcome is that we’ll start having civil wars everywhere and just kill those we oppose.
No, actually…
… but seriously, the Internet is so different from real life that no comparisons make sense. Opinions that would have been uttered by the craziest village idiots in a local gas station 30 years ago are now distributed and magnified by the social media machine. In the past, you could see with your eyes, hear with your ears and even smell with your nose which people you really really should not listen to, but in the internet, those people look exactly like you and me.
And it’s all sapping your energy and time, the most precious resources you have.
That’s why blocking is fine, even whole instances if they are shown to be crazy enough.
Also, I would like to point out that the creators of the clients for the first community platforms (usenet) recognized early on the importance of shutting people up (killfiles).
I understand what you mean but I’ll have to disagree. Letting people just do anything like that is like not charging criminals for the crimes they’ve commited. It could make people act similarly.
We have tried engaging in good faith, but they don’t WANT to hear us. For example, the mods of [email protected] (specifically https://lemmy.ml/u/OurToothbrush) ban for people for simply disagreeing with them. Happened to me and I’ve seen multiple others.
I’m surprised to find somebody with some sense around here.
I have never used a block or mute feature on any site or any service in all my life. It is wild to me that people today actually use those features, let alone to constrict the ideas that they allow themselves to be exposed to.
I conducted a fun little experiment over at /c/[email protected] in which I posited the question: “If it were possible, how would you deprogram an extreme conservative?”. I then waited twenty hours before posting “If it were possible, how would you deprogram an extreme progressive?”. The difference in reception between the questions exposed the intense lib-left bias that is pervasive on Lemmy, a byproduct of people constantly walling themselves into self-made echochambers.
I hope people do not do that and take into account this campaign against lemmy.ml. I am aware of the accusations against the admins of this instance, but I practically never see here this kind of brigading, campaigning against whole instances like lemmy.world. Sure, I myself did make a bad comment or two about lemmy.world out of >800 comments, but that’s normal. I think the fair thing to do, is to respond in the same scale (i. e. blocking specific users) instead of going all ballistic with instance blocks.
I’d also like an option to just block/hide the instance part of user names. I don’t like what this bit of information is doing to discussions in Lemmy.
You could also just move instances if you don’t want to be blocked. Hexbear, and ML are hot spots for the worst kind of people.
I know I can. Being blocked is something I do not have any issues with. My comment was merely my point of view. If someone is being actively bothered by the admins of the instance I’m in, it’s completely fair to block it. However, to block whole instances for ideological differences is kind of immature.
Cool. That’s fine that you don’t like it. However people have a right to not see what they don’t want to see. If they decide that means it’s lemmy.ml, then that’s their right.
Just like I have a right to not peer with lemmy.ml if I didn’t want to.
Hell I have a hard block on ALL Russian and Chinese IP addresses. Not because I have something against the people. But I just don’t want to deal with the headache of accepting traffic from those countries.
Just because some (or even a majority) of the people on lemmy.ml are fine to interact with doesn’t mean that there isn’t contention from other users and admins on that instance.
I think we agree on everything. You do you.
it’s not just random users, the mods of larger communities like [email protected] will delete your comments and ban you simply for disagreeing with them.
For this, some people proposed to move the community from one instance to another. Now, it seems to me like the incentive to comment on instances ideologically biased for people who cares about the voting system is basically to troll the opposing instance. Which leads to this petty battle that I will ignore from now on.
EDIT: It’s also interesting to note that lemmy.ml is not like any other instance. In fact, it would be beneficial to not have big communities here. My account is here because it’s an old account, but lemmy.ml should be more like a “testing” instance, and they probably shouldn’t be signing up more people. The admins and devs acknowledge this from time to time. So, I guess everyone wins with this.