Dutch beach volleyball player Steven van de Velde, who served time in prison after he was convicted of raping a 12-year-old girl, won his second match at the Paris Olympics and received an even harsher reaction from the crowd on Wednesday than for his first match.

  • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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    3 months ago

    What was the sentence for his crime?

    Do all nations have the same focus on rehabilitation as the US prison system?

    Is it possible for an individual to commit such an act and reform themselves, perhaps even earn the trust of society again?

    • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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      3 months ago

      He served one year in the UK for raping a 12-year-old multiple times. Then, through a treaty, he was extradited to the Netherlands and served no more time at all. He called the whole thing nonsense when the press asked him about it.

      Please do tell us how that is a fair punishment for raping a 12 year old multiple times.

    • Snowclone@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      The US does not have a rehabilitation prison system. We don’t really have a justice system, we have a vengeance system and a torture prison system. I don’t think prison should be torture or a slave plantation for any convict in any case. Although our property crime sentencing is overly harsh and violent crimes against a person are far to lenient. I think rapists need to be removed from society more than anything else, it should be up there with murder one. Also I think most non violent convicts could be on house arrest, work, pay taxes, and not be vengefully tortured.

      • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        I’m only intolerant of intolerance. That means I’ll forgive murderers and rapists once they’ve completed their punishment and rehabilitation. But, I also understand that my perspective on forgiveness isn’t common.

        • njm1314@lemmy.world
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          3 months ago

          Except you’re not forgiving them once they’ve had their punishment and Rehabilitation. As pointed out this child rapist is unremorsful. He was neither punished nor rehabilitated. He’s an unrepentant child rapist. That’s who you’re defending.

        • Kalysta@lemm.ee
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          3 months ago

          A year for multiple rapes if a 12 year old is barely a sentence, no matter what justice system you’re in. And he’s clearly not even sorry.

          • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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            3 months ago

            A year for multiple rapes if a 12 year old is barely a sentence, no matter what justice system you’re in.

            I agree. He voluntarily did more, though.

            And he’s clearly not even sorry.

            When? Before he voluntarily did more, or afterwards?

            Rape isn’t alcoholism. For some it’s maybe like heroin. But, I’ve not had a drink in more than a decade and know a heroin addict with more time under his belt. People can change.

            After he screwed up someone’s life then did more than his sentence, he seems OK to everyone he’s engaging with now. So, I wonder if I’d forgive him if I met him IRL. It’s easier to judge him without nuance hypothetically, when there’s no consequences for doing so. If I met him I’d hopefully be strong enough give him a chance.

            • Kalysta@lemm.ee
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              3 months ago

              And his victim, who has self harmed after he hurt her, gets to watch him live his best life at the olympics.

              No. That’s not ok.

              • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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                3 months ago

                If you’ll never forgive, why not just kill proactively?

                No. That’s not ok.

                • Kalysta@lemm.ee
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                  3 months ago

                  Wow that is QUITE a jump from this dude shouldn’t be in the olympics to why not kill him.

                  There is plenty of other shit he could be doing that doesn’t involve international television.

                  And no, i will not forgive rapists because I have yet to see one who has ever been remorseful for what they’ve done. Certainly not from what i’m hearing about this guy.

                  • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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                    3 months ago

                    There’s plenty of other shit you could be doing than punishing someone forever instead of offering them a quick death.

    • Humanius@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      So I’m not overly familiar, but I can try to summarize what I know.

      Steven van de Velde is a Dutchman who went to the UK and raped a 12 year-old. He was sentenced to four years in prison for this by a UK court. Later he was extradited to the Netherlands, so he could sit out his sentence in the NL. However in the Netherlands, unlike the UK, sex with a minor is not automatically considered rape and needs to be proven in court. (Note: That is my understanding of the difference in interpretation) Because of this his conviction was reduced to “ontucht”, meaning sexual misconduct. (Even though what he did would probably also be considered rape in Dutch court).
      As a result, he was out of prison after 13 months.

      Now, Dutch attitude to these kinds of things, in my experience, is generally (but not always) that if you have paid your time, and have shown remorse for your actions, then it should probably not affect your future career prospects. The justice system is supposed to rehabilitate after all. (That is my experience though, and my experience may be biased, so don’t take this as gospel)

      Hart van Nederland did a survey, and apparently only 27% of respondents think he should not be allowed to compete. 63% of respondents think he should be allowed to compete, and 10% don’t have an opinion either way. (Note that Hart van Nederland is not the most reliable of sources, but it gives an indication)

      From what I have seen in Dutch circles this controversy is a lot less pronounced than it is in other countries. That’s not to say it is entirely uncontroversial, but it’s not quite to the same degree as I’m seeing internationally.

      Personal opinion:

      I don’t think his sentence should have been lowered to “ontucht”. I think what he did is morally reprehensible, and he should have sat out the full sentence for raping a minor. That is a failure on behalf of the justice system though, and van de Velde is not personally to blame for that.

      That said, given that he has shown remorse for his actions, and has finished the sentence that the legal system imposed on him, I don’t think he should have been barred from competing in the Olympics on behalf of the Dutch team.

      Edit: As Flying Squid mentioned I might be mistaken that he has shown genuine remorse.
      If he hasn’t that changes my opinion on the matter.

      • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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        3 months ago

        given that he has shown remorse for his actions,

        Remorse?

        After his release in 2017, van de Velde complained about “all the nonsense” reporting on his crime in the media, claiming that the term pedophile did not apply to him, without expanding further.[1][20] At the same time he stated not yet having read any of the reporting he was criticizing.[21] The National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children (NSPCC) in Britain condemned his comments at the time, stating that his “lack of remorse and self-pity is breathtaking”.[15]

        Return to sport

        Van de Velde returned to international competition in 2018. He excused himself in an interview, saying about the rapes that occurred when he was 19-years-old, that he: “made that choice in my life when I wasn’t ready, I was a teenager still figuring things out. I was sort of lost”.[22] He has since described it as “the biggest mistake of [his] life”.[23]

        The Dutch Volleyball Association allowed him to resume his career as a beach volleyball player. In 2024, he was controversially selected to represent the Netherlands in the 2024 Summer Olympics.[24] However, in order to “establish calm”, the Dutch Olympic Committee isolated van de Velde from the rest of the Dutch team, and barred him from talking to media.[25] An online petition calling for his removal from the Olympics had 80,000 supporters.[26]

        His “remorse” was over getting caught. He has never offered the slightest bit of apology to the victim.

        • Humanius@lemmy.world
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          3 months ago

          If he hasn’t shown genuine remorse than changes my stance.
          Given what I had read on the matter I was under the impression he had shown remorse. Particularly the “biggest mistake of [his] life” remark.

          • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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            3 months ago

            True remorse would involve an apology to the victim. At least I think most people would think so.

            • idiomaddict@lemmy.world
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              3 months ago

              I disagree with that. There’s no need to put the victim on the spot like that. True remorse definitely doesn’t involve rejecting culpability like that though.

              • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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                3 months ago

                How is making a public apology to the victim putting them on the spot? I would say that a public apology is almost literally the least he could do for her.

                • idiomaddict@lemmy.world
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                  3 months ago

                  It means she has to decide if she’ll listen to it, when and how she’ll be able to process it, and whether she forgives him. All of that in public? Not a chance in hell I’d want my rapist to do that.

                  • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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                    3 months ago

                    Only if people expected her to respond, which they wouldn’t. The press would not be clamoring to see if she accepted it. They haven’t even named her as far as I know, since she was a minor, so they wouldn’t be able to.

                    Because all of that would be true regardless of whether he apologized in public or in private.

                    I’ve never heard anyone take a stance against a public apology before. This is honestly a very strange stance.

      • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        That squid guy is quite ridiculous. He regularly throws reason out the window to feed his ego by bashing whomever he can pass shallow judgement upon.

        “Not to excuse it in any way but this took place, I think, 10 years ago and I think, as a general rule I think we need to allow for the possibility of rehabilitation,” Mark Adams said at the IOC’s news conference on the day of van de Velde’s debut.

        That’s where I think the mob goes wrong. Rape is a pretty big mistake. But, the best people I know today are that way in total rejection of who they once were. They’ve never brought it up. I confront them when I see myself in them.

        Van de Velde was given a four-year sentence in 2016.

        …at the time of his sentencing that he appeared via video link at Aylesbury Crown Court and wept as he heard his victim ended up self-harming and taking an overdose.

        After serving part of his jail term in England, he was sent back to the Netherlands where his sentence was adjusted according to Dutch laws.

        …after his release had sought professional counselling.

        His actions seem to demonstrate compliance and remorse.

        The Dutch volleyball federation (Nevobo) said van de Velde was “proving to be an exemplary professional and human being and there has been no reason to doubt him since his return”.

        Meanwhile, the country’s Olympic committee said van de Velde had met all the qualification requirements for the Olympic Games “and is therefore part of the team”.

        Source

        Those empowered to judge him have judged him forgiven.

        On what basis should we believe differently?

      • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
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        3 months ago

        We could find a stupid or good reason to discard each and every individual. Humans are deeply flawed. I need not conveniently bash this talented man to feel good about myself. I chose the more difficult and quite unpopular position of forgiveness.

        You’re seemingly the only person who understood. You’re true to your username. I liked how you didn’t assign him responsibility for the perceived failure of the justice system. I think it was the critical thing that needed said when saying that he did more than what was mandated. Thank you for speaking up.

        Reason wins because propaganda has a much shorter half life.

              • jordanlund@lemmy.worldM
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                3 months ago

                Their original comment was removed because they accused another user of being a child rapist.

                The comment that got them a 3 day ban was for attacking a mod.

                You can see their full modlog here:

                https://lemmy.world/modlog?page=1&userId=98689

                Based on their history, I expect they’ll come back even worse and end up being permanently banned.

                • mriormro@lemmy.world
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                  3 months ago

                  That wasn’t an accusation, it was a very stupid insinuation.

                  And that comment about you is less an attack and more an accusation. If the mod team deems fit to throw around bans because they can’t deal with a random user being critical yet allow some other users on here to continue to post literal Nazi propaganda, then I don’t know man.

                  I see you around a ton, and your moderating seems to be very personal.

                  • jordanlund@lemmy.worldM
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                    3 months ago

                    It’s not personal, I don’t have that kind of time.

                    Some comments don’t get removed because they simply aren’t reported. It’s not like we’re personally reading every comment in every thread.

                    Here’s how it works:

                    We have a queue of reported messages, we go through the list and decide if it’s infringing or not.